RE: NANFA-- Tank for Johnson County Library

m c (midgatutordigests_at_yahoo.com)
Fri, 20 Dec 2002 13:44:57 -0800 (PST)

OK, so the grist of this is:
get the tank if possible, and then us we did it, and
mention that it would look better with fish in it?
Ok.

On the education grants: I would feel funny applying
for the high school teacher's grant because
technically, I'm not one yet. I won't be "official"
until the contract is signed. And the other grant
seems to be for people buildng outdoor ecosystmes or
field work.

The only "financial" support from NANFA for the
Library tank that I hope to get is in the form of
fish, and I have a way of compensating for that by
providing receits documenting the donation for tax
purposes. (and maybe some server space for a pic of
the compleated project)

The Library Board is happy to provide space for the
tank, as long as they don't have to spend anything but
the water to fill it. (they are paying for recent roof
repairs and are still fighing the county for the money
they were suppost to get 6 years ago to make the
building handicap accessible.)

I would just buy a tank myself, but I make 40$ a day
intermitently as a sub (today was show up for Math
with no books, or pencils, or paper because it is
Friday and we know we have a sub again because the
teacher is in labour still day). I would just place
one of my old 10 gals, but they are all scratched and
wouldn't be very impressive. I would put my 20, but I
plan to use it in the classroom.

So I won't commit NANFA to anything, but instead just
list NANFA as providing "Technical support" so that
those whom I am soliciting for "Material support"
won't think that I am just a lone nut.

For now, I'll just take any lack of comment from the
peanut gallery as silent consent.

Thus endeth the Planter's commecial...

--- "Crail, Todd" <tcrail_at_northshores.com> wrote:
> Let's start from the beginning and I'll move forward
> with your other questions
> that it seems you've not gotten any private repsonse
> on either. Perhaps this
> will address some other things that may be sitting
> in the background.
>
> I've recently spent a considerable amount of time
> writting about projects that
> I think would help NANFA, draw people to NANFA, and
> just serve in the good
> name of conservation. General response was "yeah
> that would be great!",
> however, as you may have noticed regarding how to
> distribute a presentation,
> as an example... The core topic *immediately* gets
> sidetracked with operating
> systems, distribution method, who will do the work,
> "I have this software that
> I'll offer my services" "that software is inferior
> to this product", etc.
> This is not a criticsm, this is just the way things
> are when you have a whole
> bunch of people trying to work over emails. And so
> that got me thinking...
>
> I had an off the record discussion with one of
> NANFA's active members about
> how they feel concerning NANFA type projects, as I
> could clearly see, that by
> just posting a quick little ditty without any
> thought given to it brought a
> tsunami of emails back and forth. It was a good
> illustration of why people
> who *happen* to be NANFA members just *do projects*
> and *then report* back to
> NANFAns about the project. This member offered wise
> advice:
>
> "Do what you were going to do anyway and then modify
> it where necessary to
> make it fit better into NANFA."
>
> That was concerning software. Does software have a
> tangible cost? You bet.
> I bill out at $150 an hour when I do this stuff at
> work, however, that's my
> donation when I set something up that NANFA can use,
> and I'm okay with making
> that kind of donation because I believe in NANFA as
> a *distribution method*
> for my causes, and that their mission is within line
> with my causes.
>
> I'd like to point out that "fit better into NANFA"
> can have two meanings, and
> I'll address the one that I think is appropriate.
> What I've determined was
> implied in this, and I think a lot of other
> education-based active members
> have determined, is that we're doing what we're
> doing because we have a
> passion for educating others about our native fish
> and the ecosystems that
> support them. So this may be more appropriately
> worded "do in a manner that
> NANFA can and would want to distribute as materials
> that meet the *entity* of
> NANFA's goals." NANFA is not in charge of what
> members would like to do. It
> does have the right, however, to determine if it
> would like to spend it's
> resources to take that project a step further or
> reward those members
> financially or with some step of recognition.
>
> So... Any project a member would want to do, sure
> it's great to have support
> and financing, but I think it would be wise to only
> expect an "attaboy" in
> return from *anyone*. Many NANFA members have taken
> it upon themselves to
> place aquariums in public places. They absorb the
> costs, don't ask for
> anything, but willingly place some mention of NANFA
> because *they feel* NANFA
> as *an entity* can help distribute, enhance or
> reinforce their causes.
>
> And before I cause assumptions to be made, let me
> say that there's absolutely
> *nothing* wrong for asking others to help absorb
> costs for a project you'd
> like to do to promote native fish. The worst that
> could be said is "no" or
> nobody responding to emails.
>
> To be blunt, the only way NANFA has commit to
> serving *anyone* or *any cause*
> financially is thru the two grants that have been
> made possible by
> memberships, auctions and the generous contributions
> that some NANFA members
> and two families make yearly to the entity of NANFA.
>
> You have some great project ideas, I would encourage
> you to apply for the
> Corcoran Grant http://www.nanfa.org/conservation.htm
> Talk to Rob Denkhaus if
> you haven't already, he'd mentioned the grant on
> Wendesday, and he's a great
> guy to talk with and can probably help nuture your
> ideas, as this is his role
> in serving NANFA. Also, look at what the recipients
> did in the last 3 years
> for the grants. You will quickly see how their
> ambitions fit into NANFA's
> scope and why NANFA rewarded them financially. And,
> you also may notice, that
> these projects were all going to be done wether
> NANFA gave them anything or
> not.
>
> This is how the entity of NANFA formally offers it's
> financial commitment to
> education. If you'd expect NANFA to formally offer
> it's financial commitment,
> it would be necessary for you to make NANFA's formal
> application and
> description of your project. And I think I've
> pointed out how people have met
> the criteria in the past to complete that
> commitment.
>
> I'm not sure why you're asking for the NANFA
> endorsement, as that endorsement
> isn't going to mean diddly to any manufacturer.
> They're only going to cough
> stuff up as endorsements/marketing for themselves.
> Of course, NANFA endorses
> any project that promotes native fish... However...
>
> What I think you need to determine for yourself
> is... Are you doing this out
> of your own good will because you want to educate
> people about native fish,
> and with what financing you can scrape together,
> because you were going to "do
> it anyway"? Certainly, seeing what support you can
> gather by posting to the
> email list is a great idea, but again, only expect
> an "attaboy" because that's
> all many others who've done similar projects have
> received, and I'm quite sure
> they were content with that. If you would choose to
> name NANFA and it's
> website on your project or proposals, that's
> fantastic. But you can't expect
> any cash or goods in return. That's not how NANFA
> operates it's financial
> commitments.
>
> I think you've already seen the willingness of
> fellow NANFAns to gladly offer
> advice, time, and critters (and there could be a
> financial value placed on all
> of that). I would take, however, the lack of
> response to your request for the
> library project as a warning sign that the people
> that comprise the entity of
> this email list (loosely labelled NANFA email list)
> aren't feeling they're
> going to get much in return or are just a little
> tired of the fast arriving
> requests. You may want to reform your approach.
>
> Respectfully said,
> Todd
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: m c
> Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 3:38 AM
> To: nanfa_at_aquaria.net
> Subject: Re: NANFA-- Tank for Johnson County Library
>
>
> Did I put everyone off by calling them baitfish?
>
> I mean that I expected a little more excitement or
> discussion on the matter.
>
> Anyway...
>
> Should I say that it is a NANFA project, or that
> NANFA
> is providing technical support?
>
> --- m c <midgatutordigests_at_yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Oh, I checked, and receits for tax deductions are
> > availible.
> >
> > So how do you put a value on a box of baitfish?
> >
> >
> > I have the letter head and am basically ready to
> go.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- m c <midgatutordigests_at_yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > Well, good news, bad news.
> > >
> > > Bad news: They ended up having to expell some
> > > students so they doon't need the parapro to
> watch
> > > them
> > > anymore. So, no job. Still a sub.
> > >
> > > Good news: Last month I asked the librarian if
> > she
> > > was open to the idea of having a native tank.
> She
> > > asked the board, and they gave an enthusiatic
> yes.
> > >
> > > So, Now what?
> > >
> > > Is there a process by which to get an official
> > > endorsement from NANFA, before I go soliciting
> > tank
> > > companies with Library letterhead?
> > >
> > > The old wooden cabinate (quite solid) that they
> > > suggest that I put it on is just over 2 ft X 3
> ft,
> > > and
> > > thus will easily hold a 29 or 47 gal. I have
> > > somthing
> > > like these in mind:
> > >
> > >
> >
>
http://www.marineland.com/products/consumer/con_combos.html
> > >
> > > http://www.commodityaxis.com/index2.htm
> > >
> > > The fish would have to be maintained with dry
> > goods
> > > for onsite storage reasons, but they would get
> > > occational "treats" from me brought from home.
> I
> > > live
> > > 2 blocks away (small town blocks). I will be
> > > responsible for upkeep, but the librarian has
> kept
> > > fish in the past and can be depended upon for
> > daily
> > > checks and feeding.
> > >
> > > Do I seem to be going the right direction with
> > this?
> > > /"Unless stated otherwise, comments made on this
> > > list do not necessarily
> > > / reflect the beliefs or goals of the North
> > American
> > > Native Fishes
> > > / Association"
> > > / This is the discussion list of the North
> > American
> > > Native Fishes Association
> > > / nanfa_at_aquaria.net. To subscribe, unsubscribe,
> or
> > > get help, send the word
> > > / subscribe, unsubscribe, or help in the body
> (not
> > > subject) of an email to
> > > / nanfa-request_at_aquaria.net. For a digest
> version,
> > > send the command to
> > > / nanfa-digest-request_at_aquaria.net instead.
> > > / For more information about NANFA, visit our
> web
> > > page, http://www.nanfa.org
> > /"Unless stated otherwise, comments made on this
> > list do not necessarily
> > / reflect the beliefs or goals of the North
> American
> > Native Fishes
> > / Association"
> > / This is the discussion list of the North
> American
> > Native Fishes Association
> > / nanfa_at_aquaria.net. To subscribe, unsubscribe, or
> > get help, send the word
> > / subscribe, unsubscribe, or help in the body (not
> > subject) of an email to
> > / nanfa-request_at_aquaria.net. For a digest version,
> > send the command to
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> > / For more information about NANFA, visit our web
> > page, http://www.nanfa.org
>
>
> =====
> This is my mailing list address.
> Please send any offlist responses to
> midgatutor_at_yahoo.com
> -
> /"Unless stated otherwise, comments made on this
> list do not necessarily
> / reflect the beliefs or goals of the North American
> Native Fishes
> / Association"
> / This is the discussion list of the North American
> Native Fishes Association
> / nanfa_at_aquaria.net. To subscribe, unsubscribe, or
> get help, send the word
> / subscribe, unsubscribe, or help in the body (not
> subject) of an email to
> / nanfa-request_at_aquaria.net. For a digest version,
> send the command to
> / nanfa-digest-request_at_aquaria.net instead.
> / For more information about NANFA, visit our web
> page, http://www.nanfa.org
> -
> /"Unless stated otherwise, comments made on this
> list do not necessarily
> / reflect the beliefs or goals of the North American
> Native Fishes
> / Association"
> / This is the discussion list of the North American
> Native Fishes Association
> / nanfa_at_aquaria.net. To subscribe, unsubscribe, or
> get help, send the word
> / subscribe, unsubscribe, or help in the body (not
> subject) of an email to
> / nanfa-request_at_aquaria.net. For a digest version,
> send the command to
> / nanfa-digest-request_at_aquaria.net instead.
> / For more information about NANFA, visit our web
> page, http://www.nanfa.org
> /"Unless stated otherwise, comments made on this
> list do not necessarily
> / reflect the beliefs or goals of the North American
> Native Fishes
> / Association"
> / This is the discussion list of the North American
> Native Fishes Association
> / nanfa_at_aquaria.net. To subscribe, unsubscribe, or
> get help, send the word
> / subscribe, unsubscribe, or help in the body (not
> subject) of an email to
> / nanfa-request_at_aquaria.net. For a digest version,
> send the command to
> / nanfa-digest-request_at_aquaria.net instead.
> / For more information about NANFA, visit our web
> page, http://www.nanfa.org
/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
/"Unless stated otherwise, comments made on this list do not necessarily
/ reflect the beliefs or goals of the North American Native Fishes
/ Association"
/ This is the discussion list of the North American Native Fishes Association
/ nanfa_at_aquaria.net. To subscribe, unsubscribe, or get help, send the word
/ subscribe, unsubscribe, or help in the body (not subject) of an email to
/ nanfa-request_at_aquaria.net. For a digest version, send the command to
/ nanfa-digest-request_at_aquaria.net instead.
/ For more information about NANFA, visit our web page, http://www.nanfa.org